Edhat Reader
By the Central Coast Antiwar Coalition
Residents of Santa Barbara, Goleta, Ojai and Ventura will deliver public testimony, Tues., December 5th, before the Santa Barbara County Board of Supervisors, urging the elected officials to join other California cities to pass a resolution in support of a ceasefire.
In early November, Santa Barbara county supervisors passed a “We support Israel” resolution (see it here) reportedly without any input from the local Muslim community. This resolution was passed during Israel’s genocidal bombings of hospitals, clinics, schools, apartments and escape routes, all while Israel was denying Gazans, half of whom are children, water, food, medicine and fuel.
Since October 7th, over 15,000 Palestinians have been killed, tens of thousands wounded and 1.8 million people uprooted from their homes. Following a brief pause, Israel has resumed its assault, using US bombs with fighter jet engines designed and manufactured by Raytheon and Lockheed Martin, both with offices in Goleta. Those Gazans who were told to evacuate to the south are now being bombed relentlessly by the Israeli military. Nowhere in Gaza is safe.
Omar Figueredo, an organizer with the Central Coast Antiwar Coalition, urged the supervisors to “Leverage your positions as local leaders to call for a ceasefire and an end to the genocide of the people of the Gaza Strip.”
Marcy Winograd, another coalition organizer, added, “We hope our county supervisors will pass a ceasefire resolution to appeal to our congress member Salud Carbajal to act responsibly in the face of profound human misery. Instead of funding more weapons for Israel, Carbajal should join the call issued by 60 members of Congress for a ceasefire. After all, there is no military solution to the violence, only a political one.”
Santa Barbara County supervisors passed the “we support Israel” resolution in early November as Israel violated international law to impose collective punishment on Gaza, where 2.3 million people were subjected to constant bombardment of hospitals, clinics, apartments, UN refugee centers and escape routes. It’s imperative supervisors act responsibly now by supporting a ceasefire to stop the genocide.
Despite global calls–including from the UN Secretary General–for a ceasefire, Carbajal refuses to support an end to the killing in Gaza that has turned the narrow coastal strip into a graveyard for children. County supervisors can at least try to change his heart and mind.
The US bears a special responsibility to stop the killing, as our government approves $3.8 billion in weapons funding for Israel each year. US weapons manufacturers produce the weapons that have killed over 6,000 children in Gaza.
A few weeks ago local peace activists picketed Raytheon or RTX in Goleta because the weapons manufacturer produces engines for fighter jets dropping 2,000 pound bombs on Gaza.
The killing must stop. Santa Barbarans and people the world over are witnessing genocide in real time.
Scroll for the proposed ceasefire resolution that has been submitted to the supervisors for their consideration.
County of Santa Barbara Resolution in Support of a Ceasefire in Gaza
WHEREAS, we mourn the loss of all Palestinian and Israeli civilian lives from October 7th to the present and throughout the decades;
WHEREAS, we call for a halt to all violence in Israel/Palestine, including a return of the hostages Hamas kidnapped and a return of Palestinians illegally detained in the West Bank and East Jerusalem, an end to Israel’s collective punishment of Gaza and an end to Hamas’ rockets into Israel;
WHEREAS an estimated 1200 people were killed and 250 kidnapped in Israel during Hamas attacks on October 7th, and as of Friday, November 24th, more than 14,000 killed, 28,000 injured and 1.7 million people displaced during Israel’s retaliatory bombings of hospitals, UN refugee centers, schools, apartments and escape routes in Gaza while Israel withholds water, food, medicine and fuel in what has become “a graveyard for children” according to the UN Secretary General …
WHEREAS, a ceasefire is supported by the UN Secretary General, countries in the Middle East, Africa, Europe, Latin America, 47 members of Congress, the cities of Cudahy, Detroit, Oakland and Richmond (CA), as well rabbis, imams and pastors, Jewish Voice for Peace and 2/3rds of the US public surveyed in a November Reuters/Ipsos poll ….
WHEREAS, the United Nations recognizes Santa Barbara, a city within the county, as an International City of Peace that affirms the Declaration of Human Rights, which states that “No one shall be subjected to torture or to cruel, inhuman or degrading treatment or punishment.”;
THEREFORE BE IT RESOLVED, the County of Santa Barbara supports a ceasefire in Gaza, where 2.3 million people, half of whom are children, have struggled under constant bombardment while routinely denied water, food, medicine and fuel, in a human catastrophe;
THEREFORE BE IT RESOLVED, the County of Santa Barbara calls on President Biden, as well as representatives in the House and Senate, to support a ceasefire in Gaza to end the cycle of violence and open the possibility of a political solution that will ensure the safety and security of all.
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I’m not convinced that local governments need to take a stand on international conflicts. I would prefer that individuals contact Congressman Carbajal directly, rather than ask the Board of Supervisors to make a statement.
Acchoooo – I totally agree. But because they did, their wisest move would be to rescind their prior resolution ,and recognize that they shoul not get caught in this trap again.
Ahchoo – I absolutely agree. These BOS or other lower level entities don’t need to keep passing resolutions of their opinions on world events. However, they did take the time to pass one in support of Israel (with no Muslim input), so isn’t it only fair and balanced to also issue one about the innocent deaths on the other side. I think so. If you’re going to insert yourself into world affairs as a representative entity, do it for ALL people you represent.
Sacjon, you make a good point. The Board of Supes should not have weighed in on the conflict. But I’m not sure making more statements is the right move; when you’re in a hole, maybe it’s best to stop digging. I’d like to see them resolve to focus on Santa Barbara county. Maybe they should make a statement saying they’ll stop making statements about international conflicts.
AHCHOOO – “Maybe they should make a statement saying they’ll stop making statements about international conflicts.” – Haha! Yes, they should!
Garbage in, garbage out. A truly nonsensical, delusional document. It would be like asking the Red Army to halt its attack on the Reichstag.
If the Supe’s value their job, they’ll send this right to the circular filing cabinet.
What about the continued bombing and maiming of civilians, most of which are children? What purpose does that serve? Do you seriously not want it to end?
If you do not want your city destroyed or your people killed and maimed, perhaps you should not sneak attack people and rape and murder their citizens. . You reap what you sow.
CHALF – hate to break it to you, but not all men, women, children and infants in Gaza are Hamas. Please update your news source.
All Hamas are Palestinians. Further Palestinians elected Hamas, support Hamas, and are onboard with Hamas in the destruction of Israel.
RUBAIYAT – Your entire comment is wrong. While it’s true that “all Hamas are Palestinians,” that does not mean all Palestinians are Hamas. That’s just simple logic and basic knowledge.
As for the rest of your comment…… some, not all. Did the 5 year olds having their limbs ripped off by bombs “vote” for Hamas 17 years ago? No. Do all Palestinians support Hamas? Absolutely not. Do they all want the destruction of Israel? Again, no. Take the time to read stories, interviews, blogs, social media posts, etc of Palestinians.
Many, many Palestinians, like many many Israelis, want a 2 state solution that will bring peace to the region. There is wrong and evil on both sides, but there are also good and just people on both sides who want this decades long conflict to end in peace for both.
You and others need to stop demonizing the victims here. It’s not only factually incorrect, it’s morally repugnant.
Wow…. 3 people agree that the innocent Palestinian women and children share in the blame for the terrible and awful 10/7 terrorist attack? Yikes…..
Because there is NO moral equivalent between planning and executing the rape, torture and murder of innocent civilians and the NOT targeted death of civilians in GAZA . This is the 16th time they have attacked Israel first. This time is going to be their last. If YOU cannot see the difference between civilians targeted for heinous savagery and the unintended deaths caused by the response, then perhaps some self introspection is in order. Some people just do not automatically side with Aggressive vagrants, crazed druggies threatening tourist children on State Street or murdering savages that are the antithesis of civilized behavior. Some just do not empathise with the bottom feeders.
CHALF – Your argument is purely emotional with no distinction between murderous, raping terrorists and innocent Palestinians trying to survive mass bombardment. Why do you blame the innocent women and children of Gaza for Hamas’ evil? Why do you wish the innocents to die like this?
Chalf — The “NOT targeted death” mantra is a complete blind copout. When you blockade 2 million people from access to basic food and water, THAT’s targetted. When you drop 2,000-pound bombs on apartment buildings leaving entire communities looking like a moonscape, THAT’s Targetted. When you force medical personnel to abandon premature babies in their powered-off incubators, THAT’s targetted. What you are promoting is in violation of every moral code of civilization. Responding to uncivilized behavior with behavior that is magnitudes worse, is not going to help Israel. Israel’s only chance for survival is to give up their illegal military occupation of the West Bank and blockade of Gaza, and become a world citizen that respects the International Conventions of which it is a signatory.
And do you really think that Israel doing what you’ve laid out will cause Hamas to become a peace loving government dedicated to the future of their own people?
Exactly what actions have they taken over the last fifteen years that would cause you to believe they desire to do anything other than continue to get rich from their own people’s suffering and attack, murder, rape, torture and kidnap Israelis and Jews?
You really think that people who rape girls to death with knives, shoot women in the head while they are raping them, cut off their breast, and mutilate them beyond recognition for the crime of being Jewish women will turn the corner and become peace loving people?
The naïveté’ of people who believe that a unilateral cease fire will lead to peace is actually astounding.
“missing a target and killing people” – Correction: hitting the target as intended, despite knowing there are more civilians than Hamas fighters there.
I still don’t get why people compare the IDF’s tactics to Hamas’ atrocious acts on 10/7. One is one of most advanced and proficient militaries on the globe, the other is a terrorist organization.
Probably because people are promoting Hamas propaganda in their attempts to portray what the IDF is doing as “genocide” and as well in attempting to portray them as morally equivalent or even tilted towards Hamas as justified “freedom fighters.”
I don’t really expect to hear a response because you’re all done here.
“I don’t really expect to hear a response because you’re all done here.” = Of course not. But here I go….
“Probably because people are promoting Hamas propaganda……” – You wildly missed the point. Are you really saying you’re justifying the brutal acts of the Israeli government because of what other people are saying? It’s what your words mean. Not sure that even makes logical sense as a response to my question/observation.
Let me try to help you here. I’m wondering why people (you mostly) seem to hold Netanyahu and the IDF to the same standards as terrorists? That’s kinda what you’re doing by constantly comparing what a sovereign, civilization nation is doing to the barbaric acts of terrorists.
“Well, Hamas did worse, so….” – Nope. Not buying that cart of poop.
1. I thought you were all done with me? Why are you still responding?
2. “Hitting a target as intended despite knowing that there are more civilians than Hamas fighters.”
You literally have absolutely no way of knowing what intelligence the IDF has in advance of an attack on a target.
Again, with the number of strikes that have occurred and the nature of the battlefield, the casualties can only be as low as they are through significant effort.
But how can we be having this conversation when you are done.
Alexblue: No one has posted that the goal is not to make Hamas a peace-loving government. It is to establish a government that is under neither Hamas nor Israeli control. There have been many attempts by the international community to do this, but these attempts have always been blocked by U.S. policy of vetoes and cover-ups of Isreali governments crimes. That policy is about to change.
I admire sacjon’s decency to you in spite of your continued twisting of his or her words, and baseless insulting cliches, but I find that the more you comment, the more you reveal your lack of knowledge. You would benefit greatly from spending your time researching and learning, so that you actually post accurate facts, instead of personal attacks. The Washington Post and New York Times have both provided reams of coverage I suggest that you go to their sites. Wikipedia also has many articles providing historic information for novices like you.
SBdiy–
So many words and none of them a specific response to any point I’ve made.
You say that I”m essentially an ignorant “novice”. And you post something like this–
“No one has posted that the goal is not to make Hamas a peace-loving government. It is to establish a government that is under neither Hamas nor Israeli control.”
What? You claim deep knowledge of the history and the players in the region and you post this? “The goal is to establish a government that is under neither Hamas nor Israeli control.”
“The goal.”
Are you trolling with this? There is no “the goal.” There is no consensus on an ideal outcome in Gaza and Israel. Hamas does not want what you claim they want. Iran does not want what you claim they want.
Now prove me wrong. Or just post a bunch of vague words with zero substance…again.
Also–you are saying that Israeli response is magnitudes worse.
So missing a target and killing people is magnitudes worse than raping a woman to death with a knife?
Is that your stance?
“1. I thought you were all done with me?” “I don’t really expect to hear a response because you’re all done here.” “Wait, you’re still responding to me? So weird. ” Blah blah blah……. It’s a new day, bub. I’ll respond how and when I want.
As for your whole “missing a target” tripe, that’s just plain disingenuous and factually wrong. IDF has admitted and confirmed targeting certain buildings and areas where civilians are known to be, look at the south of Gaza where they told civilians to go. They didn’t “miss” when they bombed the crap out of neighborhoods filled with civilians. They didn’t miss when they attacked the hospital, where they found a few guns and comm equipment. As SBdiy points out, they didn’t miss when they cut off water, food and fuel from Gaza.
For you to suggest that the THOUSANDS of civilian deaths were caused by accidental “misses” is absolute bullshit and you know it.
While they might not be explicitly “targeting civilians,” they’re certainly not “missing them.”
I really wish we had an edit function….
“While they might not be explicitly “targeting civilians,” they’re certainly not “missing them.” — I need to rephrase that to reflect what I meant. I admit that was not worded how I intended.
Please replace that sentence with: “While they might not be explicitly “targeting civilians,” they’re certainly not accidentally killing them due to “missing” their intended targets.
Lie, lie, lie.
I never said that the civilian deaths were entirely caused by accidental misses.
Either Israel goes after Hamas and thousands of innocents die or they do nothing and simply try to absorb Hamas attacks for the foreseeable future.
Of course civilians are being killed accidentally. Know that even you are not claiming that the Israeli government’s priority policy and strategy is to intentionally kill civilians.
As I said, you’re not capable of thinking rationally on this topic. You consistently make extreme and absolute statements that have no basis in fact.
Glad you’re backtracking on your big statement that you’re “done” dealing with me on this, I’ll hammer you every single time you make false statement.
LOL, Sac, cry more until you pick up your toys and go home again.
Show me the Israeli policy or strategy that targets civilians. You can’t. It doesn’t exist.
Or you could just tell me once again that “I’m fine with bombing and killing kids”. I know you like to demonize people like that.
ALEX – what is with you saying I’m crying? Is that what you think of anyone who calls you out? What are you, 8?
I don’t think I ever said there is an Israeli policy or strategy. If I did, that’s not what I meant and I take it back. I’ve simply been saying (a lot and in other words) “While they might not be explicitly “targeting civilians,” they’re certainly not accidentally killing them due to “missing” their intended targets.
You are pulling the classic Voice strategy – Motte and Bailey. Making things up that are easier to argue against because you have nothing to provide against the real argument: The fact that Israel is targeting areas where civilians are known to be.
Think about that, you know, with your critical thinking hat on. My point is (has been since day 1) that Israel is attacking/bombing areas/buildings, despite KNOWING there are civilians there. They’ve admitted it for effs sake. THEY KNEW there were civilians in the hospitals and the apartments buildings yet they CHOSE to bomb them anyways as they thought there might also be Hamas there. I’m sure there were. BUT, Israel is OK with killing civilians as a means to destroy Hamas. See for yourself:
https://www.cnn.com/2023/12/05/middleeast/israel-hamas-military-civilian-ratio-killed-intl-hnk/index.html
What I am saying IS NOT the same as saying Israel is “targeting civilians.” That I have to explain this over and over to you is pathetic.
No, Israel is NOT purposefully looking for, planning and carrying out attacks to kill civilians. Again, NEVER SAID THAT.
Once again, and really make an effort here…. Israel IS targeting places where they know and accept civilians will be killed. THAT IS MY POINT.
If you can’t see the difference, it’s either 1) your logic needs work or 2) you (like me) are so pissed off and defensive here, you’re willfully ignoring reason. I like to think it’s 2, but I don’t know any more….
Gonna say it one last time:
Saying Israel is targeting and bombing places where they know civilians to be and implementing policy/tactics/whatever such as cutting off water, food, etc to civilian populations for the purpose of killing Hamas IS NOT THE SAME as saying Israel is “targeting civilians.”
Now, let’s please try to be more civil, reasonable and respectful. We’ve gotten carried away here to a point of disrespect, insults and pure defensiveness. We’re BOTH better than that.
Sac, I’m going to wrap up my piece of this conversation with a couple of thoughts.
1. People are claiming that Israel is committing genocide. To commit genocide requires intent. And when it comes to government it requires policy. In this case, there is no proof of policy. Is there an underlying desire to do this within elements of Israeli government and extreme wings of society–absolutely. However, desire, as despicable and horrifying as that may be is not enough.
So I push back on the genocide claim until I see evidence that there is government policy in action.
2. Yes, Israel targets areas where there are civilians and Hamas is fighting or operating. Absolutely. Yes, they are hitting areas where there is a high probability of civilian casualties. Have they made choices to NOT target areas with high areas of civilian population when there MAY be low value Hamas targets. Absolutely. Israel is operating with conscious intent to keep civilian casualties at minimum. If they had no concern about this there would be 100,000 dead civilians. You refuse to recognize the choice that they are making. Recognizing that choice
2. You are saying that you have to explain this over and over to me and it is “pathetic.” Keep the insults coming. Consider the possibility that you may be using language which is inaccurate and misleading. You say “Indiscriminate” bombing. I point out that this would mean Israel is bombing Gaza with zero consideration of the impacts. You ignore that.
What they are doing is not “Indiscriminate”. That is a fact.
3. On the topic of insults. You have more than once implied very clearly, that I am “okay” with dead and dismembered children. You have implied that I don’t care about innocent civilians killed in this conflict. In the very post in which you call for mutual respect you say “what are you, 8”.
In my world, telling someone they are a dickhead or that they are stupid or uninformed comes nowhere near telling someone that they are unmoved by the deaths of children. The former are throwaway banter insults. The latter is a deep accusation that denies someone’s fundamental compassion for human life.
I am 100 percent certain that if we could both snap our fingers to create peace in the region we would. I am confident that we are both decent human beings.
“Sad knowing non-combatants will be injured/killed. But, how many lives will likely be saved knowing Hamas is no longer is capable of killing anyone?” – Yeah, I bet you’re all broke up about it. Thing is, do you truly, honestly believe that even if Israel kills every single member of Hamas, they will be safe from terror attacks?
This is my point with this whole thing. In the process of killing Hamas, they’re killing around 2 innocent Palestinians (mostly kids) for each soldier. Will the survivors truly be OK with this? Hell no. That’s exactly how new terrorists are made if you just kill everyone then leave. Look at ISIS in Iraq after we did what we did.
Further, do you really think all the other terrorists in the surrounding countries (Hezbollah, etc) will leave Israel alone after this? No way.
No. The THOUSANDS of dead civilians need to mean something. The ends can’t just be “no more Hamas.” They have to be a 2 state solution or some other end that ensures safety and peace for BOTH Israelis and Palestinians. Bombing the “schiff” out of civilians is not the means to that end. It works against it.
LOL that’s all you have? My implication? Dude, you’re so hung up on “getting me” by making assumptions and (often pathetic) logical leaps, you miss the big picture. We essentially agree on the end result….I think. Not sure though, you’re stance has become so convoluted by your incessant need to be right, I don’t even know where you are on this topic anymore.
Stick to nitpicking and inventing things to argue about (ie, I “keep” including terrorist and civilian deaths in the same number, etc). You’re becoming a pro!
Come on, what you got next?
Own your statements. You claim over and over that people are fine with killing kids. Then you cry about me saying you’re not all that bright.
None of what you have to say here matters one iota. It changes nothing. But, if you’re going to take a position for the sake of argument you should make it an honest one.
Or not. Because that doesn’t really matter either.
But yeah, I’ll admit – was kind of a dickish thing for me to say. Sorry, Doulie. I was a bit out of line there, but the substantive part of my comment stands.
Almost as insensitive and heartless as you boasting that this disaster “is probably one of the least impactful on civilians. Period.”
I dare you to say that to them:
https://www.cbc.ca/radio/asithappens/gaza-child-death-toll-1.7012927 (“More kids killed in Gaza in 3 weeks than all global conflict annually since 2019, Save the Children says”)
Truth hurts when you are so indoctrinated.
Netanyahu funded and supported Hamas at one time! Hello?
So what? a. Netanyahu is a piece of shit. b. They made a realpolitik calculation and it was a mistake.
So what’s your implication here?
What do you know about th e history of Israel/Palestine?
Democrats when terrorists attack
Perfect.
This is so far out of the role of the County Supervisors that it is a total waste of their and our time that would be better spent on doing their actual job. A County Supervisors’ resolution will have as much impact on the participants in the Hamas/Israeli war as an individual opinion posted on Facebook, i.e. none.
This is not a matter for our county supervisors to be weighing in on, they have local priorities that require their focus and this is just a waste of government time/resources. If they have an opinion on the matter they should be writing/calling their congressional representative or senator.
Well, they already did at the start of this conflict, so they might as well make it 2 sided and then be done with it. I’ll never understand the purpose of these types of resolutions. Why do governmental entity at this level need to proclaim their feelings about topics unrelated to their purview in an official manner?
“Why do governmental entity at this level need to proclaim their feelings about topics unrelated to their purview in an official manner?” Because most politicians in our state take action based on feelings rather than facts.
I agree. I don’t think this is the County Supes place to weigh in on such issues, although they already did in support of Israel so …
I am a Jew.
Any person or entity that voices opposition to this wholesale slaughter and maiming of innocents have my blessing. The Palestinians have no “safe” are left in Gaza. Israel has made sure of this!
I liken the formation of the State of Israel as a mirror image of what white settlers did to our Indian tribes and it’s still going on in the West Bank as I write. Ethnic cleansing and wholesale killing!
Most people alive today do not have any knowledge about the history of Israel/Palestine. The land for the State of israel was stolen from the Palestinians by the UN with thye help of the USA.
THE BALFOUR DECLARATION-1917
His Majesty’s Government view with favour the establishment in Palestine of a national home for the Jewish people, and will use their best endeavors to facilitate the achievement of this object, it being clearly understood that nothing shall be done which may prejudice the civil and religious rights of existing non-Jewish communities in Palestine or the rights and political status enjoyed by Jews in any other country. SO MUCH FOR THE ARAB’S RIGHTS UNDER ISRAEL’S POLICIES!
On April 9, 1948, Jewish terrorists from Jewish militias including Begin’s Irgun ( a Prime Minister in later years) slaughtered hundreds of Palestinian men, women, children and babies in Deir Yassin.
No one was punished. The al-Dawayima massacre took place on Oct 29, 1948 and IDF troops slaughtered hundreds more of innocent men, women and children again! These are just two of several murderous Jewish rampages! Loudspeaker trucks roamed the landscape telling Arabs that they too would be killed unless they left (ethnic cleansing) Palestine/Israel.The Arabs did the same type of murdering. There is plenty of blood available to all.
The Hamas attack was enabled by Netanyahu and his modern day Nazi party! The Jews who were murdered by Hamas were undefended and there was no initial IDF response for 7 hours from IDF! Netanyahu did not do his job. He backed Hamas and the chickens came home to roost!
Neither Israel nor the USA will come out losers after the war quiets down. Hamas will never be wiped out. An idea cannot be killed.
The Gaza war has increased antsemitism to its highest levels since WWII, though many Jews are not Zionists, including Orthodox Jews!
In the continuum of human war this is probably one of the least impactful on civilians. Period.
“Period” – there you have it folks. The “expert” has spoken. This war is really a big nothingburger for civilians. Totally overblown.
Wait, you’re still responding to me? So weird.
My statement is correct, prove otherwise. Show me a military conflict where the ratio of civilian deaths to military deaths has been lower. Show me a military conflict where a military power has announced their strategies and their imminent attacks in order to save civilian lives.
My factual statement that this is one of the least impactful on civilians in history in no way makes a claim that those dead and injured are any less dead and injured than they would be if there were 10 or 20x more casualties.
There are just fewer of them. Which is a good thing right?
Look, I get that you’re so emotional that you can’t handle facts–maybe you should stick with your whole announcement and not comment because you’re only going to get more upset when I respond to you with facts.
“My statement is correct, prove otherwise” – I didn’t say it was wrong. Read it again, champ. While it may be correct (not saying it is), it’s a fucking awful thing to say about dead kids, no matter how you spin it and speak down to others.
The truth matters. You want to see a true slaughter? Give Hamas another ten years in power and the ability to secure WMDs, maybe from the stockpiles of Syrian chemical weapons that are laying around or a dirty bomb supplied by Iran. Then see Hamas use that in Tel Aviv, for example.
Then you’ll see a true slaughter in Gaza.
What these emotionally driven fools don’t understand is that status quo means a high probability of exponentially higher civilian casualties in a future conflict.
5k dead children is fucking awful. 50k dead children is worse.
Ah, yes… “fools.” It’s more than 5K and we’re only 2 months into this. Also don’t forget more than half of the 42K that are injured, many disfigured and/or disabled for life. Plenty more kids will die.
Also, don’t forget – Hamas is not the only threat to Israel. That’s what makes this so important. These lost and mutilated lives must count for something. To simply “kill all of Hamas,” can’t be the endgame. A secure and safe existence for BOTH Palestinians and Israelis needs to be the goal.
You and I will never agree on how that goal is achieved. That’s fine. But simply destroying Hamas and in the process, killing and maiming tens of thousands of innocent civilians and then reoccupying Gaza is not the answer.
Woah, wait, you’re a Jew?
Well damn. Oh, wait, so what? Are you Israeli? Do you have family and friends who died on October 7th? You think that being a Jew gives you any more moral stature than anyone else?
Yeah, no.
Beyond that, “A Jew”, you’re right that an idea can’t be killed. But you can kill enough people who are trying to bring that idea to fruition that it ends up being a really unattractive idea to ally with or try to manifest.
Have you ever heard of Germany? Have you ever heard of Naziism? Yes, you have. Guess what nation is no longer governed or culturally controlled by the Nazi party. Ding, Ding, Ding. Germany.
Gaza can be Germany in a couple of generations. Robust, successful, peaceful.
Status quo is over. Re-setting now for a repeat would be insane.
Admittedly, I find it interesting (and sad) the Left is now devouring themselves over this issue.
As stated earlier, the racism on the Left is still alive, well and now bubbling to the top. In fact, they can’t seem to contain their hatred.
This was on full display yesterday, during Senate hearing testimony of the University Presidents of Harvard, Penn and MIT. When asked if student radicals calling for the “extermination of Jews” would be considered against University policy and therefore harassment, ALL answered in a vague, ridiculous diatribe. How embarrassing and telling, no wonder prominent donors are now heading for the exits.
Suffice to say, this war will unfortunately have to play itself out and tragically innocent civilians will suffer. At the end of World War II, the German SS was hunted down ruthlessly by the allies. Himmler committed suicide rather than be captured. To have left them free to cause mayhem was an unacceptable risk the allied armies which had no intention of chancing.
Such is the case now with Hamas. To leave them free to commit further atrocities and crimes is unacceptable to our ally, Israel.
SBTEJANO – “the racism on the Left is still alive” – where is the racism in criticizing Israel’s response? That’s not racist in any way.
Yeah, if people on the left (or right – where they cringe at electing a Jewish congressperson) were “calling for the “extermination of Jews” then that would be absolutely racist. I haven’t heard anyone say that though or even come close. I bet if you really listened to the responses of Presidents, you’d see why that question is so loaded.
Your problem, much like many, is that you can’t separate criticism and opposition to the actions of the Israeli government from anti-Semitism. That’s YOUR problem, not ours.
You are welcome.
Easy to understand when put in context.